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Anson:

--- Quote from: nostra on September 09, 2009, 07:20:28 pm ---isntall the latest update 0.9.9.13!

--- End quote ---

yes, thanks to your fast actions.
a few hours ago it was still 12 and that version wasn't very old either yesterday :-)

I now have installed the new version 0.9.9.13 and on a new database, I no longer get conversion errors when I add movies.

But when one problem is solved in any software, i always find two others :-)
eg that I have to manually refresh the list of movies with F5 after changing the filter settings (why doesn't that happen automatically?) and that most movies which i add with "new movie master" are added twice :-(

Reading in the WIKI explained that the latter happens when the spelling of title, original title and the spelling on the internet (eg in IMDB) don't match 100% exactly. but I couldn't find info on what it means to click checkmarks once (grey) or twice (white) in a movie selection dialog.

example: adding any title with a "different" spelling results in two entries with the original title (selected from the list), one with the typed title (as I would expect) and an URL "www.imdb.com/..." and a second entry which uses the original title as title and an URL "imdb.com/..." (added 10 seconds after the first). I also noticed that the effect might be related with the checkmarks on the movie selection dialog since it seems to happen only when a checkmark was clicked twice (making it white and not only grey).

my guess: only one checkmark can be grey and that is the entry which gets the typed title while all other checkmarks can only be white and their entries get their title set from the original titles to avoid having several identical titles. this is probably the intended behavior ?
and now the error: when there is no grey checkmark because of selecting only one checkmark and clicking it twice, PVD first (erronously) treats the selected movie like a grey one (adding it with the typed title) and then does the normal work of adding it with the original title as title like it does for all white checkmarks.



--- Quote from: nostra on September 09, 2009, 07:20:28 pm ---Restore the backup from 0.9.9.11 ...
If you do not have a valid backup: ...instructions...

--- End quote ---

thanks for these instructions.
I don't know yet whether i need them (please note that i had written "using (of course after a backup :-) the old database"), but they give a lot of insight anyway :-)

ps: after typing this lengthy text and doing experiments for the above theories, i saw the new posts when previewing my own post ... seems to be best for me to stay with version 11 for a few hours and export my database which was created with v11, and then reimport it with v14 !?
besides some own or modified fields (like title) which fields do i need to export (to CSV) to uniquely identify movies for recreating the database? In theory a single URL should do but i probably have to use some dummy title too ?

rick.ca:

--- Quote ---seems to be best for me to stay with version 11 for a few hours and export my database which was created with v11, and then reimport it with v14 !?
--- End quote ---

I'm not sure what you mean by this. There was a problem with v12. You need to install v13, and load a database that has never been opened in v12 (i.e., your v11 backup). Is that not what you did, and is it not now working fine? There should be no need to export and reimport.


--- Quote ---I couldn't find info on what it means to click checkmarks once (grey) or twice (white) in a movie selection dialog.
--- End quote ---

I've never understood what those are for either, so thanks for the research. And yes, it seems you've properly identified a bug. But there's a little more to it... I had great fun adding Inglourious Basterds as "Inglorious Bastards" according to the various circumstances you outline. I found the duplication only occurs when the field overwrite setting for Title is not set in preferences. It will create one record with the name provided, and another with the correct one identified in the search. If the field is set to be overwritten, however, the second download just overwrites the first. This too, of course, is undesirable—the second download is just a waste of time.

So I have to agree this is a bug, but I still don't understand the intended purpose of the checkboxes. If I want to be able to enter a Title different from the Original title, I have to set the overwrite for Title off. Then, if I just ignore those check boxes (i.e., double-click on the correct movie or select it and click on enter), it works fine. Greying the boxes doesn't seem to do anything different. Checking them causes a duplication.

So it's one of those bugs where the solution is, "Don't do that!"  ;D

But hopefully nostra will find a way to clean it up so others don't fall in the same trap.

Anson:

--- Quote ---I'm not sure what you mean by this. There was a problem with v12.
--- End quote ---

not only that, but i read the following as being another problem if the database was created with v11 and this is just exactly what should apply to me ...


--- Quote from: nostra on September 10, 2009, 12:24:46 am ---Normally the database should be OK if you have always upgraded it instead of creating a new database in each version (and I assume you did upgraded). The problem only aquires with database files first created in 0.9.9.11.
--- End quote ---

since i didn't add much info myself besides creating a list of movies and all those entries are missing posters because of the faulty old IMDB plugin, i have to update everything anyway. Maybe I even will finish writing my own IMDB2PVD converter to import "mymovies(all)" and preserve even the additional info from notes and which I added by putting the same movie in several categories like "box3" (for the media location), "Godzilla" or "007" (for lists of related movies), "to_see", "wish", etc :-)


--- Quote ---
--- Quote ---I couldn't find info on what it means to click checkmarks once (grey) or twice (white) in a movie selection dialog.
--- End quote ---
I've never understood what those are for either, so thanks for the research.
--- End quote ---

hehe, i like puzzles :-)


--- Quote ---And yes, it seems you've properly identified a bug.
--- End quote ---

i like it even more if i really could help


--- Quote ---...only occurs when the field overwrite setting for Title is not set...
--- End quote ---

it took me ages (hours) to find why i couldn't set title to something else than the original title


--- Quote ---I still don't understand the intended purpose of the checkboxes.
--- End quote ---

i think that the intended purpose might be to enable you to select whether you want the typed title or the original title for each new movie, without setting the options to different values temporarily. and this feature might be really powerful in those few circumstances where you want to add a movie with your own title, find several matching movies, and then can select which movies should be "batch-processed" for import with the original title while keeping the differently typed title for exactly one of them.
I don't know whether those forced original titles (for all movies but one) are important at all. I can imagine cases easily where i want to import all those matching movies with my own typed title, either to select and keep one of them later and delete the others, or to adjust all titles later. But most of the time, people probably want to add only a single movie and should be aware of what "grey vs. white" means :-)

Now (after we know all this) there is one really important missing feature in the selection from multiple matching movies and also later in the PVD database itself (when importing from IMDB; i don't know the details for other services): the titles shown are only titles with years, but missing other critical important info which is shown on the original selectionpage on the web, like what that shown title is, eg title (yyyy) for cinema movies, title (yyyy) (TV) for TV movies, title (yyyy) (V) for video movies, "title" (yyyy) for series, or title (yyyy) (VG) for videogames. The IMDB also has a suffix for the year (yyyy/I), (yyyy/II), etc if there are two identically written titles in the same year and that is missing too in the selection list. Currently, I first have to open the webpage for each of them to check.

To know what i mean, just use "new movie master" to add "predator" or "alien" from IMDB and enjoy the videogames :-) or try adding "Around the World in 80 Days" from 1989 or "Dinotopia" from 2002 (btw: the latter also shows another problem: if the internet offers the wrong poster by default, I have no option in PVD to select another picture from IMDB, either immediately or as separate picture import).


To leave the original thread subject even more, here are two other bugs (hehe, as promised: one solved, two new found :-) which i found while experimenting on a temporary database in version 0.9.9.13:

I created the new database by seleting "open..." and then typing "test" (lowercase). This resulted in a database to be created with the name "TEST" (uppercase, and more important: without suffix .PVD). Until here, it's only a feature and would be a matter of personal preference whether databases without suffix are allowed (it only makes it harder to find it later when trying to open it again), BUT: PVD creates backups of this database "TEST" with the name "TEST.PVD.BAK" instead of only appending ".BAK" to the database name. What would happen when you have one database "TEST" and one database "TEST.PVD"? There would probably be only one BAK file for the most recently used database ...

The second bug is not serious but annoying: if i use "new movie master" to add a movie and then cancel the selection dialog for multiple matches, the typed name of the movie is added to the database and shown in the list of movies: original title empty, year empty, title as typed, dates for added and modified set properly. Shouldn't "cancel" mean to do nothing and add nothing so that i don't have to look for it and delete it afterwards ?


ps: PVD in general is a really nice program, and what i write is only meant to help with some "details". If I wouldn't like PVD, I wouldn't care to test and post at all. If something is written too long or is too complicated to implement now, etc, simply skip it and put it behind the end of the todo list :-)

[Post edited for readability—using quote and horizontal rule tools provided.]

rick.ca:

--- Quote ---The problem [the corruption of the database by 0.9.9.12] only acquires with database files first created in 0.9.9.11.
--- End quote ---

Does that help? If all databases first created with 0.9.9.11 are now unusable in 0.9.9.13, then we have a huge problem. !'m quite sure this is not the case.


--- Quote ---Maybe I even will finish writing my own IMDB2PVD converter to import "mymovies(all)"...
--- End quote ---

If you want to start over, that's up you, but you don't have to. The import plugin will add information to specific fields in existing records, and add new records if they don't exist. Just cut & paste a My Movies table into Excel, clean it up, and import. Be sure to include the year—that helps a lot in ensuring proper matches to existing records.


--- Quote ---I don't know whether those forced original titles (for all movies but one) are important at all. I can imagine cases easily where i want to import all those matching movies with my own typed title, either to select and keep one of them later and delete the others, or to adjust all titles later. But most of the time, people probably want to add only a single movie and should be aware of what "grey vs. white" means :-)
--- End quote ---

Can you give me an example of the case you're imagining? I can't think of anything, and am therefore inclined to think the ability to add multiple movies causes more confusion (and bugs!) than it's worth. Without it, the behaviour of keeping or replacing the title is controlled by the overwrite fields option. I think it appropriate this is an option rather than being specified for each download—I prefer to do the download as quickly as possible, and trust the consistent result. If I don't like it, I can change it after the download. I don't set my titles to be overwritten, BTW, but still sometimes change it. That's either because the title I used was simply incorrect (e.g., misspelled) or I realize only after seeing the poster the appropriate AKA is something different (e.g., the English release name of a foreign title).


--- Quote ---Now (after we know all this) there is one really important missing feature in the selection from multiple matching movies and also later in the PVD database itself (when importing from IMDB; i don't know the details for other services): the titles shown are only titles with years, but missing other critical important info which is shown on the original selectionpage on the web, like what that shown title is, eg title (yyyy) for cinema movies, title (yyyy) (TV) for TV movies, title (yyyy) (V) for video movies, "title" (yyyy) for series, or title (yyyy) (VG) for videogames. The IMDB also has a suffix for the year (yyyy/I), (yyyy/II), etc if there are two identically written titles in the same year and that is missing too in the selection list. Currently, I first have to open the webpage for each of them to check.
--- End quote ---

I agree—for IMDb, those suffixes are important and should be included in the selection dialog. They should not be appended to the title or otherwise added to the database, however. If the attribute is relevant, it should be included in the data downloaded anyway. BTW, the purpose of this dialog is to resolve ambiguity in a title that should at least be close to being correct. It's not intended to be a search for when you can only guess the title. So if Alien (1979) is what you want, it will appear at the top of the list. Better yet, if your were to create a record with the title and year, their would be no ambiguity and the information would be downloaded directly. If Alien vs. Predator (2004) is what you want, don't enter "Alien." But I pick this this example to illustrate something else. "Alien vs. Predator" is apparently the unambiguous name of a 1993 video game, and that will be downloaded directly if that is what is entered. If you can't recall the actual name of the movie is AVP: Alien vs. Predator, enter "Alien vs. Predator x." Including the "x" will force the selection dialog to appear.


--- Quote ---if the internet offers the wrong poster by default, I have no option in PVD to select another picture from IMDB, either immediately or as separate picture import
--- End quote ---

Getting posters is not what the movie information plugins are for—there are poster plugins for that. The poster retrieved from the IMDb is a rather low resolution image used for the thumbnail on the movie main page. There was a time when it wasn't even downloaded. But we thought it would be helpful in verifying the intended movie was downloaded, and to serve as a poster if nothing else could be found (tip: set the poster overwrite to "grey"—so the plugin will download this poster only if one doesn't already exist).


--- Quote ---I created the new database by seleting "open..." and then typing "test" (lowercase). This resulted in a database to be created with the name "TEST" (uppercase, and more important: without suffix .PVD).
--- End quote ---

I suppose the filename that appears in the titlebar should include the extension, but—as is the Windows convention—all files have an extension whether one is specified or not. If you check in Windows Explorer, you'll see your file is named TEST.PVD (and it's backup will be TEST.PVD.BAK). If you reload the file, I'm sure the extension will appear in the titlebar.


--- Quote ---Shouldn't "cancel" mean to do nothing and add nothing so that i don't have to look for it and delete it afterwards ?
--- End quote ---

No. Assuming there was a reason NMM was used in the first place, you still may want to do something with this record. You could, for example, revise the title (to make it less ambiguous) and/or add the year, then run the plugin again (i.e., with the record selected, not using NMM).


--- Quote ---ps: PVD in general is a really nice program, and what i write is only meant to help with some "details". If I wouldn't like PVD, I wouldn't care to test and post at all. If something is written too long or is too complicated to implement now, etc, simply skip it and put it behind the end of the todo list :-)
--- End quote ---

Don't be discouraged if the "one solved, two new found" thing doesn't seem to be working.  ;)  We appreciate your input. The program wouldn't be as good as it is if some users did not take the time to test it thoroughly and discuss their findings.

Anson:

--- Quote ---If all databases first created with 0.9.9.11 are now unusable in 0.9.9.13, then we have a huge problem. !'m quite sure this is not the case.
--- End quote ---

true, but since i didn't add much info of my own yet (besides the list of movies itself and some titles chosen from the aka instead of using the original title), at least *I* don't have to take a risk and can start over with a newly created database in v13 or v14, importing a CSV with only title/otitle/year/URL.

btw: which are the minimum fields needed by PVD to get uniquely identified movies when importing a CSV?
when i have a list of URLs, that should be good enough to get exactly the movies i want by using an import plugin (filling the title and/or otitle and a year, and without need to search or get a selection dialog), but I don't think that PVD likes a database with only URLs in it and neither title nor otitle (or the same dummy title "xyz" for all of the movies).

Most databases use a primary key, or they need to generate one from other fields. In PVD, the index is optional. Thus:
- which fields does PVD use to uniquely identify a record? Is that the original title plus the year? If yes, then what about movies like "Dinotopia (2002)" (there are two of them!), or a movie and a videogame with the same title and year?
info for people who don't know IMDB closely: they make "title (year)" unique by adding unique info either to the title (using "title" for series), and/or after the year (like mini, TV, V, VG), and if all this is not enough by adding an index to the year (like yyyy/I, yyyy/II, etc). similarly, an index is added to actors/directors/etc with the same name. Thus it would be really nice if I could use such additional info on searches, and if PVD (or the IMDB plugin) would be able to store such info in some field or custom field (the plugin seems to store other IMDB specific info in custom fields too, like top250).
- is there any method to specify an URL in addition to or instead of a title/otitle/year when adding movies? It would be nice to be able adding new movies (eg with "new movie master") when i found them on some website, by just doing a cut&paste of the URL ... (it would be pure luxury to have a browser plugin that allows for a single click to add the current URL as new movie to PVD :-)

I'll give an example here in more detail (so that you don't have to do all this yourself :-), for different attempts to add one specific of the two Dinotopia movies:
1. specifying just Dinotopia as original title in "new movie master" presents a selection dialog with two of the list's entries being identical Dinotopia (2002) and showing nothing else (like aka titles, additional suffix, index, etc), which requires me to open the browser and check each of them. btw: doing similar work on people is easier since the IMDB people plugin also omitts the index, but at least lists all the additional info which is presented on the selection webpage.
2. specifying the exact "Dinotopia" (2002/II) as original title in "new movie master" avoids the selection dialog and immediately downloads the correct movie. This also sets the title to "Dinotopia" (2002/II) and the original title to Dinotopia (i have set options to overwrite the original title on doing IMDB imports to keep titles current in cases like "Bond 23", and set the option to not overwrite the title). Thus the unique original title is lost and only preserved in the title (caused by the import plugin and not by PVD itself; but as i understand, original titles in PVD never should have a year included?)
3. creating a new record with a dummy title xxx and the correct URL (without dummy title, nothing is stored when i try to "apply changes" to the edit, and i even don't get a warning about it), followed by doing the import manually. This works but requires several steps and causes problems when I first add several movies with URLs and identical dummy titles and then update all of them (occasionally presenting me with a "what should I do, apply changes to xxx or add a new movie?")
4. specifying the exact URL of the movie in a line between "original title" and "Files(s)" in "new movie master" avoids the selection dialog and immediately downloads the correct movie. ... hehe, I started dreaming after doing experiments 1-3 :-)


to sum it up: when i have a list of URLs (no matter whether i have titles and years too), it probably would be best to import them from a CSV which holds pairs of "dummytitleNNNNNNN" for the "original title" field and "http://www.imdb.com/title/ttNNNNNNN/" for the "URL" field, plus more optional fields like my own titles, wish/seen status, etc !?!

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