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Adding movies, etc.

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Anson:
i had this written as "ps", but since i just got the answer, i write it here as intro:

ps: how large may a post be in this forum ? :-)     .... just got the answer and had to split this post ...
and how many new subjects do we have in this thread about one specific error in v12 ? But maybe (at least in this case) better fill this thread with loosely related subjects instead of filling the forum with lots of separate threads ...



--- Quote ---... my own IMDB2PVD converter ...
Just cut & paste a My Movies table into Excel, clean it up, and import.
--- End quote ---

Exactly that "just clean it up" is the reason for my converter: as I already wrote in my old post, i stored info like DVD location, seen/wish status, "belongs to 007 series" in mymovies by creating one or more additional entries for the same movie in categories like "box3", "to_see", "wish" and "007", thus producing a mymovies.html list of 5 MB with thousands of entries :-)


--- Quote ---
--- Quote ---I don't know whether those forced original titles (for all movies but one) are important at all. I can imagine cases easily where i want to import all those matching movies with my own typed title, either to select and keep one of them later and delete the others, or to adjust all titles later.
--- End quote ---
Can you give me an example of the case you're imagining?
--- End quote ---

example for "adjust all titles later": When I want to add the Alien/Predator/AVP series, I might first type "alien" as title and import all found movies. If the plugin replaces the title with the original titles, I would have to take notes first and then flip back and forth in the list of movies, or use filters for "last added" etc. But by using the search term which i gave as title, i would have them together with the same (incorrect) title and would be able to easier edit this set of movies (changing titles of movies i want to keep in the list, deleting the videogames, etc).
example for "to select and keep one of them later": When I want to add only one movie but find several, it might be nice to import all of them first, all of them with the same title which i typed, and then later browse them in PVD instead of having to open a browser for each of them on the selection page. Since I delete all but one anyway, it makes no sense to select first which one should get the typed title, then browse them while (mostly) having the original titles, and last (after deleting all but one) renaming the remaining movie again.


--- Quote ---But most of the time, people probably want to add only a single movie and should be aware of what "grey vs. white" means :-)
--- End quote ---

--- Quote ---... inclined to think the ability to add multiple movies causes more confusion (and bugs!) than it's worth.
--- End quote ---

seems as if we agree :-)


--- Quote ---I prefer to do the download as quickly as possible, and trust the consistent result.
--- End quote ---

same for me ... but i trust no fully automatic systems for selecting something.
that's also a reason why i would like to be able to add movies by URL instead of title: finding a new title should be easiest when i can use all options of the internet database where i want to get the info from. When i finally found the title i want, i cut&paste the URL and create the PVD entry (see above: editing and using a dummytitle should not be needed, but using new movie master with an URL or even a browser addon would be nice).


--- Quote ---If I don't like it, I can change it after the download. I don't set my titles to be overwritten, BTW, but still sometimes change it. That's either because the title I used was simply incorrect (e.g., misspelled) or I realize only after seeing the poster the appropriate AKA is something different (e.g., the English release name of a foreign title).
--- End quote ---

I use local titles, but want a consistent database with unique titles, and thus stick to the original titles from the IMDB and also would like to keep their standard for making the original titles really unique in case of multiple movies in the same year, movies with the same name and year as series, videogames, etc. I don't change the titles "only sometimes", but for 99% of the movies since I want to use the local (German) titles as titles, and thus had to clear the "overwrite titles" flag too.

When working with local titles, there are two missing features which might be done in future versions:
- searching for German titles works when the "also search aka" flag is set, but it is very hard work to find the matching title from the selection list since that selection list doesn't include the additional info (like complete aka etc) which the IMDB offers on their own webpages. Using the website for searching and then importing the movie by using the URL would be a lot easier, if there were a simple method to "add by URL" in PVD.
- after importing a movie, i have to find the complete German AKA with correct spelling in the list of aka. currently this aka field is empty for many movies although the list exists on the website (BUG!). and if it exists in PVD, it doesn't include the additional info like languages or versions to which the aka apply. it would be really nice if i had that info and even would be able to mark one or more of the aka titles to be used as title, instead of having to cut&paste them from the aka field to the title field.


--- Quote ---I agree—for IMDb, those suffixes are important and should be included in the selection dialog. They should not be appended to the title or otherwise added to the database, however. If the attribute is relevant, it should be included in the data downloaded anyway.
--- End quote ---

the keyword seems to be "should" ... currently, the IMDB plugin stores not enough info to keep (or recreate) a unique title for later use.
recently, additional "fun" info like "top250" can be stored in custom fields, but the type of record (videogame, series, etc) or the additional index to non-unique "title (year)" records are lost. this probably will make it also difficult to properly clean up the database and find real duplicates and remove them automatically.


--- Quote ---BTW, the purpose of this dialog is to resolve ambiguity in a title that should at least be close to being correct. It's not intended to be a search for when you can only guess the title. So if Alien (1979) is what you want, it will appear at the top of the list. Better yet, if your were to create a record with the title and year, their would be no ambiguity and the information would be downloaded directly.
--- End quote ---

which gets us back to what i wrote above: doing a search first on the website and then import a specific movie with some simpler means than is currently possible.

currently, I would have to do that search for a German title on the web, then copy the English unique title, paste it in "new movie master" as original title, also cut&paste the German aka in "new movie master" as title, and then download info. If i didn't get the German aka before download, i will have to search through the aka list if it is available at all (or better yet go back to the website and look for the German aka directly since i get akas there with info on country/release etc), then cut that too and paste it in the title field in PVD. And since the English unique title was only in the original title, and won't be copied automatically to the title when i use an aka there, it will be lost ...
no wonder that the "new movie master" is often used as a tool to search and add a movie in one step.


--- Quote ---If Alien vs. Predator (2004) is what you want, don't enter "Alien." But I pick this this example to illustrate something else. "Alien vs. Predator" is apparently the unambiguous name of a 1993 video game, and that will be downloaded directly if that is what is entered. If you can't recall the actual name of the movie is AVP: Alien vs. Predator, enter "Alien vs. Predator x." Including the "x" will force the selection dialog to appear.
--- End quote ---

nice idea and hints, but it doesn't always work as expected :-(
I just tried to use the new movie master for "Alien vs. Predator (2004)" and got a list of 14 entries to select from, and also "AVP Alien vs Predator (2004)" still gives a list of 12 selections, and who will be able to get the punctuation right for all movies? you never know the official IMDB spelling of titles which include any special chars like ":", ",", ".", "-", etc.
As last attempt in this series, I used "AVP: Alien vs. Predator (2004)" as original title and it was imported automatically, only to ask me in the end whether to use an existing entry or create a new one (I had done these tests on an empty database, but one of the first partial matches had stayed in the database when i used "cancel" on the new movie master)

the IMDB website separates all those suggested selections by "most popular", "full match", "partial match", etc, but in addition to the missing suffixes like (VG), also those categories are not shown. Thus it probably is really easiest to use the web to get to an URL instead of a title and use that URL for adding the movie (see several times above :-)


--- Quote ---
--- Quote ---if the internet offers the wrong poster by default, I have no option in PVD to select another picture from IMDB, either immediately or as separate picture import
--- End quote ---
Getting posters is not what the movie information plugins are for—there are poster plugins for that. The poster retrieved from the IMDb is a rather low resolution image used for the thumbnail on the movie main page. There was a time when it wasn't even downloaded.
--- End quote ---

The IMDB offers lots of fullsize pictures for movies, including posters, and sometimes even for different language versions of that movie. It would be nice to have a separate plugin to get them, in addition to the amazon and other plugins which do a lot of guesswork on titles and mostly offer pictures to sell DVDs and box sets instead of offering posters for movies.

when I used v11, the IMDB plugin seemed to try in vain to download posters, but the most current IMDB plugin downloads posters nicely, and not only thumbnails. it seems to follow the link of the thumbnail and download the fullsize version of it from the picture collection. There are some movies which have only thumbnail sized "fullsize pictures", but when you check them at the website, those movies are mostly old and/or have no or a small selection of pictures at all (might also be related to copyright, if lowres thumbs are OK and no fullsize poster is publicly available).
Thus it should now be worthwhile to write poster plugins (for movies and also for people) for IMDB ...



--- Quote ---
--- Quote ---I created the new database by seleting "open..." and then typing "test" (lowercase). This resulted in a database to be created with the name "TEST" (uppercase, and more important: without suffix .PVD).
--- End quote ---
I suppose the filename that appears in the titlebar should include the extension, but—as is the Windows convention—all files have an extension whether one is specified or not. If you check in Windows Explorer, you'll see your file is named TEST.PVD (and it's backup will be TEST.PVD.BAK). If you reload the file, I'm sure the extension will appear in the titlebar.
--- End quote ---

sorry, you are wrong. you easily can create files in windows which have no suffix, eg by typing "echo x > y" on a commandline, or by entering a filename without suffix in some programs' fileselect boxes (just try what I wrote: use "open..." in PVD and type "test" as database name; to be sure I just did it again, typed "xy" and created a new database "XY" without suffix). maybe you can set flags in your program code to enforce fileselect boxes delivering only names with some (default) suffix, and maybe that depends on the version of windows too, but in general the fileselect only returns a string and the program has to care for it to be a valid filename with a desired suffix.
on VERY old computers with DOS or the first versions of windows, it is a bit different. there you always had only those 8.3 filenames, with 8 bytes reserved for the name and 3 for a suffix (even if it is empty/unused, which was possible even in those times). But starting with the "long filenames" in windows you now can have any string as filename, including as many or as few dots as you want (even two like TEST.PVD.BAK, none like TEST, or something like "what you always wanted to know .....mpg" :-), and also suffixes of any length (like .jpeg instead of .jpg).
hehe, a question for endless discussion: what would be the "suffix" on the name "TEST.PVD.BAK"? would it be a name "TEST.PVD" with suffix "BAK" or a name "TEST" with suffix "PVD.BAK"? *I* would say neither, but a filename "TEST.PVD.BAK" with no suffix, since my windows has no file association defined for any of those two suffixes (pvd.bak or bak)

I looked at the filenames only in windows explorer (hehe, i didn't look at the titlebar at all before you said that the filename is there too :-) and i have set the explorer to show all filenames with suffixes, all hidden and system names, etc. thus the database really was named "TEST" only and its automatic backup was named "TEST.PVD.BAK". btw: the title bar doesn't include a suffix for the database name, eg for my current "testmult.pvd" it only shows "Personal Video Database (testmult) - Movies"

new details on this bug: when you use "new...", PVD (or the new-fileselectbox) automatically adds .PVD to what you typed, if it doesn't yet have a defined suffix (watch out, typing xx.txt creates a database with the name xx.txt and no .pvd suffix), but if you use "open..." and enter some string, that string will always be taken as it is and no .PVD will be appended.
Besides this difference with the suffix, BOTH options can be used for identical purposes: "new..." and "open..." BOTH create a new database and open it when the file doesn't exist yet, and BOTH will only open and not create a new database if the database already exists. in none of these tests did i get any warning or error like "database not found" when using "open..." with a nonexisting name or "database already exists, open it?" when using "new..." on an existing name.



--- Quote ---
--- Quote ---Shouldn't "cancel" mean to do nothing and add nothing so that i don't have to look for it and delete it afterwards ?
--- End quote ---
No. Assuming there was a reason NMM was used in the first place, you still may want to do something with this record. You could, for example, revise the title (to make it less ambiguous) and/or add the year, then run the plugin again (i.e., with the record selected, not using NMM).
--- End quote ---

probably a personal preference ...
Assuming there was a reason i canceled NMM in the last place, I don't want to search my database for "leftovers".
If i would want to do something with this record, for example revise the title and/or add the year to incrementally narrow down a search, i would in the first place have created a record instead of using NMM. But if i wanted to use NMM, I probably would have copied the title which I entered in NMM, and then be able to start NMM over and over, pasting and modifying the title every time, and then end up with a dozen incomplete records from all those canceled calls of NMM.


--- Quote ---Don't be discouraged if the "one solved, two new found" thing doesn't seem to be working.  ;)
--- End quote ---

that never happened ... (should i use ":-)" or ":-(" here ? :-)
i rather get the impression that the number increments over time: "1 solved, N found"

patch:

--- Quote from: Anson on September 11, 2009, 12:20:41 pm ---The IMDB offers lots of fullsize pictures for movies, including posters, .....
Thus it should now be worthwhile to write poster plugins (for movies and also for people) for IMDB ...

--- End quote ---
Agree


--- Quote ---
--- Quote ---
--- Quote ---I created the new database by seleting "open..." and then typing "test" (lowercase). This resulted in a database to be created with the name "TEST" (uppercase, and more important: without suffix .PVD).
--- End quote ---
I suppose the filename that appears in the titlebar should include the extension, but—as is the Windows convention—all files have an extension whether one is specified or not. If you check in Windows Explorer, you'll see your file is named TEST.PVD (and it's backup will be TEST.PVD.BAK). If you reload the file, I'm sure the extension will appear in the titlebar.
--- End quote ---

sorry, you are wrong.
--- End quote ---
....

--- Quote ---hehe, a question for endless discussion: what would be the "suffix" on the name "TEST.PVD.BAK"? would it be a name "TEST.PVD" with suffix "BAK" or a name "TEST" with suffix "PVD.BAK"? *I* would say neither, but a filename "TEST.PVD.BAK" with no suffix, since my windows has no file association defined for any of those two suffixes (pvd.bak or bak)

--- End quote ---
Behaviour depends on if windows is configured to show known suffixes or not.
If it is configured to show suffixes, then you need to enter them. If it is configured to hide known suffixes then application defaults are generally applied.

File type (suffix) is always the characters after the last period "." (but you may need to configure windows to show it to see it).

rick.ca:
I'm not sure where to begin... ???

You do a very good job of figuring out how things work. That's good, because PVD is a powerful and in some ways complex program. I think you're moving a little too quickly from understanding how something works to judging how it should work. Your suggestions are welcome, but try to bear in mind you're not the first one to figure out how something works and consider how it might be better. All that your talking about here has been discussed in the past, and most of it has seen program changes and refinements based on those discussions.

It's helpful (for those of us who are so full of questions) to understand PVD is running on a Firebird RDBMS. Records in the movie table are referenced by MID—a field maintained and strictly controlled by the software and Firebird. The process of ensuring duplicates are not created is entirely up to the user and the program logic. The latter will use the title, original title, year, and perhaps the URL to make that determination. Inherent in that logic are assumptions about how much ambiguity needs to be removed. For example, given the same title and year, a match will be assumed—even though it's possible the items are unique. Often the user is asked to resolve an ambiguity.

So? Don't worry about how the program is going to create a unique record—that's beyond your control. Don't change Original title—that's meant to be, well, the original title (and it's probably pointless for any of us to second guess IMDb's determination of what that is). Use Title however you like—probably "localized," and so the records visually distinct in the list. How that's done is a matter of personal choice. I remove prefixes, structure the name so movie series appear in order and display the list as Title (Year). Don't use dummy names for titles—you'll just screw-up the program's attempts to avoid adding duplicates. Yes, include the URL if you can (that eliminates the plugin's need to do a search), but this has nothing to do with the creating of a record.

Use NMM for the purpose for which it was intended and nothing more. It might be best to use New until you fully appreciate how things work. That way, you'll see whether the record is already in the database (when the database is large, it usually is, because it's in someone's filmography or it's connected with another movie). You'll see how adding the year will resolve ambiguity, and adding the URL will eliminate the need for a search. NMM is intended as a convenience for adding one movie. If it's not a convenience, don't use it. In other words, if you need to see the IMDb search page, then use the IMDb search page (you can use a Web search to get there).

If I wanted to add both Dinotopia's, I would do this (I know nothing about the title, other than two of them exist): Add "Dinotopia" using New. An invisible record in my database appears (this is not unusual—there are 28,000 people in my database, some of whom are associated with this title). Great—that means I already have the URL and there's no need for a search. Download. I was hoping IMDb would provide me with a Connection (and a URL) to the second one, but it doesn't. So I add another "Dinotopia" and update it. The search presents two "Dinotopia (2002)"s at the top of the list. Being fearless, I guess (correctly, of course). Alternatively, I could have used the search page. Now that I've got both records, I see one is a mini series and the other is a series. In PVD, the fact one is a series distinguishes it from the other, but I might change the titles to "Dinotopia: The Series" and "Dinotopia: The Mini-series."


--- Quote ---after importing a movie, i have to find the complete German AKA with correct spelling in the list of aka. currently this aka field is empty for many movies although the list exists on the website (BUG!). and if it exists in PVD, it doesn't include the additional info like languages or versions to which the aka apply.
--- End quote ---

I assume you're using the AKA search option. I believe this searching the AKA site to find the title, but the plugin is still downloading the information from the main site. It, of course doesn't include the full AKA listing—that's the purpose of the AKA site. If you need it, you can access the AKA site using a Web search. See Localized IMDb search.


--- Quote ---the keyword seems to be "should" ... currently, the IMDB plugin stores not enough info to keep (or recreate) a unique title for later use. recently, additional "fun" info like "top250" can be stored in custom fields, but the type of record (videogame, series, etc) or the additional index to non-unique "title (year)" records are lost. this probably will make it also difficult to properly clean up the database and find real duplicates and remove them automatically.
--- End quote ---

I stand by the point I was making—appending additional information to Title would be pointless and contrary to its purpose (as mentioned above). I would agree there may be some merit in downloading this information to a new Type field. It might be a little tricky, as all that is appended to the title is TV, V or VG. In some cases (only for TV, it seems) additional information (like "TV series 2000-2003") appears as a subtitle. I suppose the best way to do it would be to get the subtitle if it exists, and otherwise the appendage.


--- Quote ---when I used v11, the IMDB plugin seemed to try in vain to download posters, but the most current IMDB plugin downloads posters nicely, and not only thumbnails. it seems to follow the link of the thumbnail and download the fullsize version of it from the picture collection.
--- End quote ---

I'm well aware of how it works—it was my suggestion to use the full image rather than the thumbnail. But I see no need to go beyond that. Compared to other sources, the IMDb images are inconsistent (and include a lot of crap) and of marginal quality. In short, it's not suitable for an automated plugin. Given the nature of the images there, you pretty much have to go there and look. Web search is the appropriate tool for that.


--- Quote ---sorry, you are wrong.
--- End quote ---

Amazing! That's never happened before. ;)

Or now—you're misinterpreting what I said. Of course it's possible to create a file without an extension in Windows. I said the Windows convention is that applications should ensure the appropriate extension is included. Thus, standard file save dialogs do not normally require an extension be provided—a default will be assigned. So the bug is that the program fails to add the PVD extension if an apparent extension is provided. This shouldn't happen—databases obviously should not be named "Test.TXT" but it should be possible to use something like "Test.abc" (without it becoming an "ABC" file). Hmmm... I see that does work properly—the filename becomes test.abc.pvd. But "Test.exe" becomes test.exe. It seems if a registered type is specified that is used, and if not, "PVD" is added. Definitely a bug, but one of those ones where we can say, "(Until the next release) don't do that!"

BTW, I just had to try... executing "test.exe" does nothing. :)


--- Quote ---But maybe (at least in this case) better fill this thread with loosely related subjects instead of filling the forum with lots of separate threads...
--- End quote ---

Perhaps, but there's a cost—I doubt anyone else will bother reading this. [Edit: except for patch, who has posted while I type.] If there is some part of this that requires more discussion and is of interest to others, we can alway quote parts of this into new topics. You may need to do that if you expect nostra to find and act on your bug reports. As I've indicated, I don't think either of the two you've found are urgent—they can wait until the next update. And then there's the feature request to add a Type field. I suspect that will be added to one of his mysterious (and lengthy) TODO lists—and may happen some day.

rick.ca:

--- Quote from: patch on September 11, 2009, 11:01:26 pm ---Behaviour depends on if windows is configured to show known suffixes or not.
If it is configured to show suffixes, then you need to enter them. If it is configured to hide known suffixes then application defaults are generally applied.
--- End quote ---

The Hide extensions of known file types Windows setting is just a display setting and has no bearing on how the file save dialog works. If you test it, you'll see it works as I describe in my last post. What I'm not sure of (and I doubt it matters) is whether it's treating all registered file types differently, or just some specific ones.

Anson:
-- I'm not sure where to begin... ???
-- maybe (at least in this case) better fill this thread with loosely related subjects ...
-- If there is some part of this that requires more discussion and is of interest to others, we can alway quote parts of this into new topics.

That's what i meant ... doing several separate precise threads for important parts, and keeping lengthy posts to a single thread which others are able to ignore if not interested.


--- Quote ---You do a very good job of figuring out how things work. That's good, because PVD is a powerful and in some ways complex program. I think you're moving a little too quickly from understanding how something works to judging how it should work. Your suggestions are welcome, but try to bear in mind you're not the first one to figure out how something works and consider how it might be better.
--- End quote ---
in some cases, i have a strong opinion on how something should work (or at least how it shouldn't work), like the problem with the suffix, but in most other cases it is only what I myself expect (and then i am surprised when it is different) or what i would think would work best for me. a few things are also caused by the complexity and missing info (missing meaning "i couldn't find it" :-) like what you explain below on how PVD probably identifies unique records (which i find important since uniqueness appears at several places like on entering new movies, cleaning up the database, etc). thus please take it only as impressions of someone using it and being surprised sometimes, and as I wrote in another post "if it doesn't apply or is too complicated, skip it or move it behind the end of the todo list" ...


--- Quote ---All that your talking about here has been discussed in the past, and most of it has seen program changes and refinements based on those discussions.
--- End quote ---
I read forums for quite some time, and also looked at the wiki etc, but the amount of data is overwhelming and many threads in forums start on problems with old versions. too bad when i skipped such threads while there might be nice info which applies to new versions at their ends. thus i decided at some time to stop reading only and tried starting to use PVD :-)


--- Quote ---I don't think either of the two bugs you've found are urgent—they can wait until the next update.
--- End quote ---
of course not — of course :-)
for me, priorities on bugs are:
- find how to reproduce it and whether it is a bug at all
- find how it might be caused and what can be done against it
- know the bug and avoid it if possible, waiting for a fix in some future release
and only for program-breaking bugs (like conversion errors on the database :-) I expect a fix (or other reaction like a "reroll") really fast (as fast as one can expect from voluntary work on a free program :-)

back to bugs and features ...


--- Quote ---So the bug is that the program fails to add the PVD extension if an apparent extension is provided. This shouldn't happen—databases obviously should not be named "Test.TXT" but it should be possible to use something like "Test.abc" (without it becoming an "ABC" file). Hmmm... I see that does work properly—the filename becomes test.abc.pvd. But "Test.exe" becomes test.exe.
--- End quote ---

sorry, you didn't get the whole point of what i wrote ...
I just tried the name "new.abc" and it stayed that way, NOT appending .PVD !!!
(you probably use "new..." while i am talking about what happens when you use "open...")

The problem is that both "new..." and "open..." can be used for creating a new database and for opening an existing database. while "new..." appends (with additional conditions like already registered suffixes etc) the .PVD suffix if a new database is created like you said, using "open..." to create a new database NEVER adds the .PVD suffix, neither on a name like "new.txt" nor "new.abc" nor on a word without any suffix or dot in it like "TEST".

I don't care much whether .PVD is appended to the names of new databases or not, but i think it should be done consistently, either in both "new..." and "open..." or in neither of them, and I am confused a bit that there are two commands for the same purpose (to create a database if it didn't exist as well as to open it if it exists or was created). if "new..." would only create a new database and open that database but not open existing databases, and "open..." would only open existing databases, there would be no such problem with the suffixes.

Thus i would consider the bug/feature/problem to be that "new..." doesn't give a warning when used for an existing database and instead quietly opens the existing database (hehe, at least it doesn't silently purge it and create a new one), and that "open..." also accepts typing errors and creates a new database if the user didn't intend to (why would he have used "open" instead of "new" in the first place) instead of giving an error or at least a warning that the selected name doesn't exist.

my suggestion for a fix: either implement the above restrictions for "new..." (don't open existing databases or at least warn) and "open..." (don't create new databases or at least warn), or merge the two commands to a single "open/new" command which behaves like it currently does. For security reasons, I would prefer the former (two commands with warnings).


--- Quote ---BTW, I just had to try... executing "test.exe" does nothing. :)
--- End quote ---
never believe what someone else tells you :-)

--- Code: ---C:\PVD\_mydata_>test.exe
Program too big to fit in memory

C:\PVD\_mydata_>

--- End code ---



--- Quote ---It's helpful (for those of us who are so full of questions) to understand PVD is running ...
Records in the movie table are referenced by MID—a field maintained and strictly controlled by the software and Firebird...
--- End quote ---

yes, those are the basics I want to know. Even if not in great detail, i immediately get a better understanding of lots of software (not only on PVD) when i get some foundation to build my guesses and beliefs on :-)


--- Quote ---The process of ensuring duplicates are not created is entirely up to the user and the program logic. The latter will use the title, original title, year, and perhaps the URL to make that determination. ...... Often the user is asked to resolve an ambiguity.
--- End quote ---

Since I want to use PVD to take care of many tasks and make work easier for me, I want to be asked to do decisions as rarely as possible, even more so when doing "batch work" (working or updating lots of movies at once). That's why i tried so hard to learn about uniqueness, and/or to try and create uniqueness with the methods available in PVD.
I am also a bit spoiled by the IMDB which on one hand created some rules to make all titles unique while on the other hand not caring at all for duplicate entries in mymovies. I didn't like all of these rules, but it was a framework to build on.


--- Quote ---Don't change Original title—that's meant to be, well, the original title (and it's probably pointless for any of us to second guess IMDb's determination of what that is).
--- End quote ---

Since i don't live in the USA (not even in an English speaking country) or in many other countries which produce movies, I used the original title (from IMDB) almost not at all, except for having unique identification of one movie. and the rules for those names on IMDB are relatively simple: it is the title in the language of the film's original country of production (transcribed if chinese etc), followed by the year of first release (not production), with additional markers for the type and in a few cases with an index added to the year. But since i didn't use it much, the only important thing for me was its uniqueness, and that is partially lost on the PVD's original titles (without year/index and flags).

But you got me thinking .... For other users who don't use IMDB as their main or only source, this uniqueness probably is less important and might not apply at all if the different services use completely different standards to find original names.


--- Quote ---Use Title however you like—probably "localized," and so the records visually distinct in the list. How that's done is a matter of personal choice. I remove prefixes, structure the name so movie series appear in order and display the list as Title (Year).
--- End quote ---

I probably will use the title only for storing the "german original title" and put other info in custom fields, eg for media location and movie series ... it would be nice if i could setup several schemes for "tree view nodes" to easily and quickly switch between them and not have to go through preferences to change that, for viewing lists sorted by movie series name and sequence (eg 007, Godzilla), or theme series and sequence (eg "other japanese monster movies" :-) or sorted by folder/box where i keep the DVD, etc. And the same might also be an idea for a set of advanced searches, to be able to select a subset of movies and display them in a nice tree :-)
... but i just started experimenting with what might suit me best among the currently available options.

but there is one problem with the title field: when i have movie connections to series, the title of the series and the episode number are included in the link, and PVD puts them in the original title and in the title. when i update this record, the plugin will change the original title to the episode title (or i have to switch that off every time i update an episode) and thus series title and episode numbers are lost from that one field. When i also put the german title in the title field, all this additional info would be gone from the other field too and thus be lost completely.

another problem with those links from connection info probably has been discussed already a hundred times, but i just stumbled about it and almost broke my leg :-) ... when i have a series added to PVD and there is some movie connection to episodes of that series, it would be nice to have them point into the series and not create "virtual movie entries" (and an option could select whether PVD might create a partial tree for conections to a series which doesn't exist yet), else i will end up with dozens or hundreds of simpsons and south park episodes in the main movie list. That applies even more if i already have nicely prepared a series (with all details, posters, whatever) and those connections still point to "virtual movie entries" for the episodes which have no info at all besides a title and an URL. ... I know that those features are deeply connected to the database structure and also to all related plugins and are not easy to do, but I hope such features might be somewhere down (but not too far :-) on the todo list for some future versions?


--- Quote ---Don't use dummy names for titles—you'll just screw-up the program's attempts to avoid adding duplicates. Yes, include the URL if you can (that eliminates the plugin's need to do a search), but this has nothing to do with the creating of a record.
--- End quote ---

it has not ? ... I tried creating a new record with only an URL and neither title nor original title, and it didn't work. on doing the "apply changes", the edit session was closed and nothing happened. the record was lost. (btw: i see it as missing feature when i am not warned about losing a record with possibly lots of data because of having neither title nor original title.)

thus: how do i create (or import) a new record with an URL to get all details from a plugin later, when i may not use "dummynames"? Do I really have to cut&paste the URL and also cut&paste the correct corresponding title, only to be able to apply the changes to the record and a moment later overwrite the title i just copied when using a plugin on that URL ?
That's why i had thought about how a dummyname should look like:
- never look like a real movie title (thus ""dummyname")
- never look like other dummynames (thus adding the number from the URL)
- not be a title (which i spare from overwriting in plugins)
- be an original title (which will be updated from a plugin)


--- Quote ---It might be best to use New until you fully appreciate how things work. That way, you'll see whether the record is already in the database (when the database is large, it usually is, because it's in someone's filmography or it's connected with another movie).
--- End quote ---

that's how i added most movies until now: first added one single movie, then followed connections to movies i knew (have as DVD, taped, or wishlists, etc), update those records too, follow more connections ... but since i have many more movies than i thought and already partially have sorted them (using categories in IMDB for remembering storage locations), i wanted to try the other approach of using the URLs from mymovies, importing them all (together with some fields and custom fields, like wish, seen and storagebox) and then let PVD work by its own, updating all records.


--- Quote ---You'll see how adding the year will resolve ambiguity, and adding the URL will eliminate the need for a search. NMM is intended as a convenience for adding one movie. If it's not a convenience, don't use it. In other words, if you need to see the IMDb search page, then use the IMDb search page (you can use a Web search to get there).
--- End quote ---

no objections :-) but after looking it up on the web, do i really have to manually start creating a record, fill it with an URL and a title (and possibly a year too) which will be overwritten soon, apply the changes, and then use one or more plugins, or wouldn't NMM be the ideal tool to add a move when i feed it an URL (just like i can feed it a title or a file now) ?


--- Quote ---
--- Quote ---currently this aka field is empty for many movies although the list exists on the website (BUG!). and if it exists in PVD, it doesn't include the additional info like languages or versions to which the aka apply.
--- End quote ---

--- End quote ---

yes, i use the AKA search option.
and no, the info i was missing was not only available on the AKA site, but every movie now seems to have one page .../releaseinfo with all releasedates and all AKA names.

example: there are five movies in the old "planet of the apes" series of movies. four of them have their aka field filled after using the IMDB plugin, but "Conquest of the Planet of the Apes (1972)" only has an empty aka field although there is aka information (just like on the other four) at http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0068408/releaseinfo.
can you please check whether you get the same result (or non-result) ?


--- Quote ---... appending additional information to Title would be pointless and contrary to its purpose (as mentioned above). I would agree there may be some merit in downloading this information to a new Type field.
--- End quote ---

agreed ... i never meant to ask for it to be saved at a specific location, but only to please preserve the info somewhere so that it can later be used again, eg to search/filter on the type or recreate movietitle strings with an export filter ... and i think it is at least as valuable as the top250 or similar info which currenly already can be stored to custom fields.


--- Quote ---It might be a little tricky, as all that is appended to the title is TV, V or VG. In some cases (only for TV, it seems) additional information (like "TV series 2000-2003") appears as a subtitle. I suppose the best way to do it would be to get the subtitle if it exists, and otherwise the appendage.
--- End quote ---

some time ago, they have changed the display on some pages. the internal titles themselves should still always be formatted with (TV) appended, or with "title" instead of title for series, etc, but to make it prettier, it might be displayed differently on some pages, like a subtitle "TV series 2000-2003".

the unique name should not be too "tricky" exactly because of what you say: all that is appended to the title is almost only (TV), (V) or (VG). in addition to these three flags they used to have another flag (mini) for TV miniseries, and series are not marked with an appended flag but by putting the title in quotation marks ("series") which automatically implies that it is a TV series and thus (TV) is omitted from the "series" (TV) (although i think that was a bad design decision since cinema series like Flash Gordon Conquers the Universe (1940) are now only listed as movie and not as series, thus not being able to have episode titles for them; but that has no influence on the uniqueness of the title). The most difficult part might be to determine whether to store an additional index (roman numerals which are appended to the year (yyyy/II) if everything else would not be unique) to the same or yet another custom field, or maybe simply copy everything behind the title (year, optional index and optional suffix) to a custom field just like they appear (with parentheses etc).

maybe we should talk about the details (name of field, what to store, etc) later and someplace else if someone has decided to implement something. For now, I only wanted to try convincing somebody that such a feature (storing unique identifiers which are available anyway) would be useful at all.

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